I am not a "Strong Black Woman" (Rant)
I am not a Strong Black Woman. In fact, I don't really even know any Strong Black Women. When the rest of the world finds her or them, and reveals their true identity, I truly hope that they will let me know, because apparently there is some confusion. I am caught in a trap of mistaken identity, causing me to go through my life with a label that causes people to see me as someone I truly am not. Perhaps there is a tribe of them living somewhere, or maybe she is a mythical superhero. I am not "tough" or "strong". I can't "deal with it". I am not going to "make it through this" and no I don't "know what you mean because I am THAT kind of person" and I rarely if ever, "tell it like it is". I am referring to the cultural phenomenon of assigning near superhuman emotional strength to me and for the most part to entire group of women, without really having any knowlege of myself or my personality. I have begun to have a sneaking suspcion that I have been duped. Perhaps, giving me this label allows others not to have to acknowledge my feelings, or treat me with the same respect that they would give to others when dispensing what in any other context would be considered rude or insulting but instead is labeled ADVICE. Unfortunately, I really believe that the "Strong Black Woman" for most people trancends racial boundaries and can include any woman who dares to have an opinon on any subject. Apparently this gives people Carte Blanche the opportunity to openly share there rude commentary about you, your hair, your life, your eating habits, and your child rearing in a way that they would never do to the iconoclasticly (sp??) Nice White Woman. I don't know her either...maybe they are neighbors???
***Can any of you Mamas relate to this?*****
"But is it my manner that keeps her from hearing, or the threat of a message that her life may change?"
-Audre Lorde
especially in light of raising a child of color...i think it's society's way of denying the complex nature of your/her womanhood in a very passive aggressive way. you hit the nail on the head, and i just had to respond. i totally see the stereotype and i think you are dead on, per usual, woman.
well you know just because black folks do it to you to doesn't mean it's any less racist. Just means it's internalized racism. I do agree with you, and I have been guilty of allowing other people to be rude to me and take advantage of me in the past because I didn't want to be seen as 'the loud angry black woman'. It took me a while to understand that for folks who are racist or who have interanlized racism, there is nothing I can do to change their belief. They are going to see me as an 'angry black woman' no matter what I do or don't do. They are going to see me as the 'strong black woman' no matter what I do or don't do. All I can do is assert myself and clarify how I feel. trula mama zine * for the kiddies
Every human is an artist. The dream of your life is to make beautiful art~don Miguel Ruiz
What a kickass thread. Thanks.
Yes, you are right. Much better way of saying it, that is kinda what I meant by "beyond racism". Internalized would be clearer though. When I said it goes beyond racism, I am saying that it goes beyond those obvious, purposeful and easily recognizable ways of being racist.
And you are also right that there is nothing I can do about it. It is so internalized, that we have turned it on ourselves and refuse to get help for depression and anxiety, because we are strong black women and we can deal with it. This particular woman, although african american, in my opinion has truly internalized the predominant cultures values as far as communication, and the idea that nice civilized white girls speak in hushed tones, never really disagree, and I think that I found it more hurtful coming from her, and I didn't want to recognize it for what it was. I am so glad to see that I am not the only one who has experienced it. I am constantly telling my husband that I am so tired of being people's designated Angry Black Woman.
This is beautiful...and something I've talked about with a couple of friends before. I can see how this would be passive agreesive and how it would make you feel like your feelings are not being acknowledged. How freaking frustrating!
I don't really have any wonderful insights, just wanted to share that there are others who wonder about this and that I thought your writing rocks.
Adults ought to skip more often. -Anna Maxted
Remember that you are unique, just like everyone else.
strong black women and nice white women, both. they both make me sad. they both try to fit these ridiculous roles that they see in waiting to exhale or some crap. typing is hurtful, because it denies the person the understanding and respect they need, and the typor (typist?) the experience of knowing a full person with fears, concerns, beauty and depth. i really think they're internalizing the leave it to beaver model, they're getting it from tv and movies. i'm somewhat ostracized in my community for being who i am and couldn't change even if i tried. sometimes i get the feeling that these women, the aforementined "nice white women" who've never heard the word fuck and wouldn't know what to do if you said it to them, just want me to try. try to change who you are, we don't care if you succeed, look at us, none of us succeed, just please try to fit the mold, so we know we're doing the right thing by changing ourselves. sorry lady, can't help you there.
"You know, I could write a book and this book would be thick enough to stun an ox." - Laurie Anderson
"I've done a lot of things in my life I ain't too proud of, and the things I am proud of are disgusting." - Mo Szyslak
Oh yes, I know EXACTLY what you mean. I got into it with a co-worker over this last week. I was talking with another co-worker about marriage and stuff, he has 3 kids by 2 mothers, never married. He expressed the desire to marry before he had more children. His main reason being that it was so hard for him and his kids that they couldn't live together. I agreed with him, and expressed how hard being a single mother was for me. This other co-worker jumped in with all that' you're a strong black woman' nonsense and was completely taken aback when I forcefully said no I'm not!! I asked him, do you really think that black women are genetically stronger than other women, physically, emotionally, whatever, so much more than other women that we don't need husbands/partners in raising our kids? And pray tell, do you honestly think black children don't need an involved father?he of course said well that's not what I meant. I mean that as a black woman you have a historical legacy of being able to deal with a tremenous amount of stress. I said hmph, please understand that what you believe is a myth, a stereotype, and completely untrue. We are not superwomen, we have been and continue to be broken by stress, even killed by stress caused from believeing we are 'Strong Black Women'.It's such obvious bullshit I cannot believe that this is a cultural myth we even sorta 'value' in our communities. Black women suffer from depression more than other women in americaBlack women suffer physical illness as a result of stress more so than other women in americaThe rates of suicide among black women have actually risen in the past decade while going down among other racial/ethnic groups in america
trula mama zine * for the kiddies
Every human is an artist. The dream of your life is to make beautiful art~don Miguel Ruiz
I know, I know. People are like unable to be sympathetic to you and just totally blow you off when you are going through something, assuming that you are not hurting, or that it means nothing to you. ARGH. How is it that you as one single woman can possibly have a historical legacy? Bullshit is right Trula. I really wish that we as black women would really just step back and refuse to accept it. I am so proud of you for saying that to him
Hipmama Quote of the Week:
"She actually begged me to act normal on several occasions."
-Lady Kaboom
it gets worse! today while I was visiting friends folks were talking about this horrible fire that happened a few weeks ago. 7 kids died and one woman and now the fire dept has determined it's arson. some people were actually saying well we know they'll (the family) get through it because they are strong black women. !!!!! I was so through, I was all Their kids are dead! WTF are you talking about this strong black women crap for??? Can't we even grieve and mourn our children? sheesh!trula mama zine * for the kiddies
Every human is an artist. The dream of your life is to make beautiful art~don Miguel Ruiz
I don't get that at all. Seven kids died.
gonna slap you.
it was actually 8 kids and teens and one adult, my bad. I don't get it either, like I know it wasn't said unkindly or anything but it's like the general tone is that these 'strong black women' will be able to bear the grief of losing their kids because they're so 'strong'. Like they are not in severe anguish and despair because they are black.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8052470/
trula mama zine * for the kiddies
Every human is an artist. The dream of your life is to make beautiful art~don Miguel Ruiz
yet not suprising, considering the kind of crap people said to me when my youngest (premie) was in the hospital on life support for months!
You'll be fine. You can do this. You are a strong black woman.
The Hipmama Quote of the week:
"I have noticed that the people who have called me 'strong' are the exact same people who will pile the shit on that requires me to act strong in order to survive."
-mrs. sauce
It is yet another label to "keep the woman down!" Seriously, it is another way that womena re made to alter themselves to either fit or compensate for thier "appropriate" behaviors. it is trying and ridiculously impossible to fit a label, especially oneas degrading adn unrealistic as "strong black woman or nice white lady. Like the previous black women were weak? Or the previous white women were mean?
I am sorry you have to deal with additional burndens to your life due to others idiocy.
You should come live wtih me in my nice little bubble where everyone is nice to each other and all colorc are seen and celebrated. *sigh*
"certified kick ass by dreammama"
i have noticed that the people who have called me 'strong' are the exact same people who will pile the shit on that requires me to act strong in order to survive. The people who expect me to be 'nice' are the people who treat me in such a not nice way.
* I'm all fight and no flight *
Exactly!!
That is so true that it is....
The Hipmama Quote of the week:
"I have noticed that the people who have called me 'strong' are the exact same people who will pile the shit on that requires me to act strong in order to survive."
-mrs. sauce
I hear it alot in mediation.
Thank you for openning my eyes again, Freedamomma.
Boomer is so 2005.
i want to thank freedamomma for bringing up this topic and trula for adding her experience.
i want to let you all know that for me, moving to this area was quite an enlightening experience as well. i grew up in the sticks, among pie-faced crackers. and for a long time i too had an impression of black women as tough and intimidating. moving here, where there are more people of color, i was disappointed in the separation that exists between white and black people, despite the diversity in the community, at least that's how it is here. it reminds me of what rosie perez said once on oprah. there was this internalized racism in her, she believed maybe not that she was inferior, but that "their world" was inaccessible to her. she was defensive, never the first to say hi to a white chick, putting on a tough stance and making them approach her as a defense mechanism. she talked about how she didn't even know it was there till she was in therapy or something. it seemed to jibe with what i was experiencing in dd's school, where most of the mothers are black and single. there's a separation here, probably like everywhere. pta mothers look down their noses at mothers who don't have a lot of time to volunteer, etc. some of them would come out with comments like you describe, seeming to actually believe that they're paying a compliment. it never seemed insulting as all hell and it made me sad to see these women just take it. well anyway, rosie perez would be delighted to know i started to try harder and be the first to say hi and all that, make more of an effort despite my shyness, and i found these women to be receptive and one degree of that separation came down. but yeah, i think that perception of the "strong" which really means "tough" which really means "hard to handle" is a hurtful stereotype. i guess all stereotypes are hurtful. but one could go on and on about where it comes from. what about black women's lives necessitates extra strength? often, creating the appearance of strength fends off people who may want to fuck with you, so why would that be necessary?
i think we all carry these images with us about what the world thinks we should be, and it can be a real source of pain for a lot of people. a lot of the hipmamas talk about not fitting into the mother mold, whatever that means for them, and that's very real. i think too that the treatment i got recently at dd's school had a lot to do with these images of what a mother should look and act like and my failure to adhere.
i really like your quote, "i rarely, if ever 'tell it like it is'" something about that really strikes me funny.
"You know, I could write a book and this book would be thick enough to stun an ox." - Laurie Anderson
yeah, I can really relate to Rosie Perez. I am a friendly person but also innately shy, so sometimes I don't speak to strangers. This has often been mistaken as me being 'angry' rather than shy. I have also noticed with some white women that unless I am all effusive and smiling constantly than I am seen as 'angry' and 'aloof' and 'difficult' from jump. It took me a while to understand that for folks who are racist or who have interanlized racism, there is nothing I can do to change their belief.
I remember once at a PTA meeting everyone wanted to sell cookie dough as a fundraiser, right during girl scout season. I thought it wasn't a good idea and said so, in a quiet, normal tone of voice. You would have thought I had jumped on the table and screamed at the top of my lungs the way some of the white moms reacted. It's like for folks who believe that black women are loud and angry, any disagreement or difference in opinion is seen as crazy, loud, and threatening, no matter how the difference of opinion is dleivered. I used to get upset at it but now it leaves me feeling puzzled and sad. Do you remember that hair post I did here last year, when I nicely asked some mamas not post disparaging remarks about curly or nappy hair in my blog, and they were all why are you so mean! why are you so angry! what is your problem! and so on. I was like huh??? I still wonder what kind of mental contortions they had to undergo to see my post as angry or threatening.
trula mama zine * for the kiddies
Every human is an artist. The dream of your life is to make beautiful art~don Miguel Ruiz
you know, the part that's reacting to you, you see only the tip. everything else is what came before, and you can't change what came before. i get this thing with people, they always think i'm trying to make trouble, stir things up, i think it comes from my style of dress. so i have a similar problem with trying to express a different opinion, i'm either dismissed or accused of being combative. on more than a few occasions, someone else in the same meeting would make exactly the same point as i did, sometimes in the same way, and it's totally received. we're all human. it's weird how i am just learning this now. just because someone is a teacher or the principal of a school, doesn't mean they will be fair to all the kids or parents know what i mean? somehow i thought that since the job requires fairness, that they would put their shit aside, but humans don't work that way. we have to be open and receptive to everyone, whether they're meeting our expectations or not. most of what's reacting to you is stuff you don't see. the iceberg.
"You know, I could write a book and this book would be thick enough to stun an ox." - Laurie Anderson
That situation with your blog was one of the main things that I think about, when I think back on this. How it is just so pervasive that it goes to even fearing it in such an on line liberal community. I don't think that anyone was trying to be racist, or realized that it was going on. But that whole situation really brought out those issues for me. I know that you have no loyalty expectations of me, or anything, and I don't want to imply here that you and I have some kind of pact or oath to eachother to be agreeing with each other because that would just be silly and ridiculuos. However, although I was late to the party, I did read the post eventually. I personally could see where you were coming from. I really saw that you were being typecast in my opinion, and I felt that if I jumped in and said how I felt about it, it would just reinforce that idea of hostile -angry -oversensitive- black -woman -with chip on shoulder about hair/race etc. Whether that was the reality of the situation or not I don't know. However, I really thought at that time, that ***subconsciously*** race played a role in how people reacted to you saying that. So I really felt in a conundruum about sharing my opinion on the issue, because I just didn't know if it would help and I also felt like maybe I was just reading too much into it. To be totally honest though my immediate thought (whether appropriate or not), when I read it was "Why is it when a black women expresses dissaproval about something it automatically becomes that she is mean and has a bad attitude???"
Thanks, Freedamomma, for your words on that. It's a stereotype many people have about black women, and no matter what we do, they refuse to change their opinion. I had long been moving toward an attitude of 'state my opnion, then disengage from the argument' but that thread really reinforced the idea for me. When I talk to people who are viewing me through a warped racial lens, it is so disconcerting because at first often I don't realize they have me fixated/typecast a certain way, and then I waste time and energy trying to clarify what I mean. That particular thread, I felt like Alice trying to talk to the mad hatter, it made that little sense to me their insistence that I was being 'mean' and 'angry' and all that. Now when I get a sense of it being someone who has a warped view of me, I call them on it, and walk away.
trula mama zine * for the kiddies
Every human is an artist. The dream of your life is to make beautiful art~don Miguel Ruiz
Late again, so little time to log on lately! I just want to give you a big hug...I saw an episode of Oprah a while ago, the promo show for Diary of A Mad Black Woman, and I felt like crying when she expressed how much she enjoyed the film for showing "black folks doing normal stuff that we all do - that's right America, we go out to dinner, we go to the bank!" (I'm paraphrasing...) but it was a strong, sad point - most of white America can't even picture people of color doing the mundane, because they never see it. That's sick. The "Strong Black Woman" myth really reminds me of the one my mislead 70s feminist Mom fed me my whole childhood - the "You can have it all - career, family and politics" myth. NO, you can't. It's why Gloria Steinem didn't marry until she was in her 50's! She has long been credited with this myth, and still defends herself from it, saying "I never said that, in fact I'm the one that said you CAN"T!" I think lots of women of our generation suffer from this myth, and can relate to what you're talking about if they think about how we're now expected to be great mothers, partners and careerists, seamlessly, with a smile. I have never believed in the SBW, she's iconic, like you said, like the NWL, and when you have lots of family and friends of color, they are just that, stereotypes. I am hurting over the many times I've seen what Trula is talking about played out. I'm thinking of all the times I've put members of our (black)Muslim activist community in a room with our mostly white Green Party so they can merge agendas. Once I held an educational meeting in my home where I had an involved black mother who went from being a volunteer to becoming a teacher to protect her 3 sons in their school, and a community education program director to talk to GP members about what's going on in our schools, especially in regards to black children being treated badly, and the only black member of GP didn't come, saying something like she didn't want to sit around and listen to stereotypes about her community...sigh. And I understood. Those were my only attempts to try to educate GP about what the REAL issus in our city are, and it was interesting to see who listened, and who reacted. I was pleased that alot of people listened. It was sad that most of the older people ( the 45-65 folks, white men) reacted, and behaved the way you described, as though my activist friends were angry loud black folks...and ps, should we NOT be angry when we're talking about how a segment of our neighbors aren't getting adequate education and access to healthcare because of the color of their skin?! I'm rambling, but I want to say that it's so important that we keep talking about this with each other, and our friends and family around the dinner table and on the bus stop. I get to have interesting conversations on both sides, because white folks assume I'm all white, and black folks assume I'm mixed, and one of them... so I often get the "YOU know how it is" ( or" you know how white people are", more often than not) party line from both sides, and end up having to try to be this diplomat building bridges most times. Sometimes I'm tired of it. ALL the women in my life are strong. And vulnerable, and shy, and sensitive, and loud and angry, and wonderful and beautiful, and broken, and stressed and so many other things. Maybe we just need to call a spade a spade more often, and say to people "When are you going to see me as a whole person, with all the same feelings and complexities as you, instead of a cartoon or mythical icon?" just before we walk away.
There is going to be a PARTY of bacteria in the bottom of my shoe!! -Astrid, Age 5
Someone in the know told me that all those years Gloria Steinem was doing what she did, she lived out of boxes (for YEARS), having never given herself time to unpack.
"ALL the women in my life are strong. And vulnerable, and shy, and sensitive, and loud and angry, and wonderful and beautiful, and broken, and stressed and so many other things."
You are on it mama!
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Unfortunately it just tends to be true on a regular basis. It is one thing for me to be reading bell hooks writing about it, but it just totally another thing when I am dealing with friends, family members, and random strangers. What is even worse is that we often do it to each other. I have spent the entire weekend with DH's (white conservative)family who for all they have seen and interacted with me just don't know me at all. They are so rude and insulting to me all the time of course in a very passive agressive way God forbid that they actually be straightforward about anything. If I say anything, just one little thing back to defend myself, it becomes that I am this big BITCH. If it was just them, I would be tolerant, however, I get annoyed because during this same weekend, another woman who is a woman of color(living largely outside the black community as I myself am), and an acquaintance of mine, put the same shit on me.(Which is why I think this goes WAY beyond racism at this point) I have never yelled at her, raised my voice, nor even been brutally honest or particularly straightforward with her. However, she is constantly saying she is intimidated by me as well as every other african american woman we come into contact with because we are just "you know..." However, she could not fill in the blanks. Ironically if anything I am a sensitive little creature who worries constantly and gets walked all over by my friends and family members on a regular basis, for failing to set appropriate boundaries. I just got to the point yesterday where I realized that I have been trying so hard not to be seen as a rude, loud, bitchy, overly agressive black woman, that I am just allowing other people to just really take advantage of me and say things that I probably have no business listening to, in an attempt to prove them wrong (especially with DH's family). I am at the point in my life, where I am just going to start letting this be their issue, since they seem intent on labeling me that way anyway. Hipmama Quote of the Week:
"She actually begged me to act normal on several occasions."
-Lady Kaboom